what is the reason why........

Originally Posted by Sumyr

Afrosaxon, Direct me to the line that says others dictate "my" views? In saying all of that was that a yes or no to my question? I guess you read those lines of my post that you wanted to read as I said you have every right to respond with "your" opinion? I never asked if you cared for Cosby, but what he was saying. However, you still manange to miss the overall point of my post - which was the main people that champion that we should support each other don't support their own themselves and are quick to banish people from our communities just becase we don't always agree. Eliminate, Imus, Oprah, Cosby and others from my comments if it bothers you that much - now would you agree with those statements? Probably not, as you avoided the overall meaning of my statements all together and just centered on Imus. Why not address the other portions of my statements? And if you have read my past posts you would know I am Nvery aware that music is entertainment and most are in it to make money - lyrics have no bearing on our overall culture.

Again, you continue to prove my point in my original post as we can't ever have a discussion without somone saying that someone else doesn't have a sense of history simply because we disagree. Point proven.........as it always is.

But in keeping with my own advice that we don't listen to each other - I will put my opinion aside (for the moment anyway) and listen to what you have to say. Tell me, what is it you want to say and what is the answer for bettering our communities - old wise and knowledgeable one??? The floor is yours - I'm all ears.

I do not need to link to anything. You proved by you bringing Imus up. You are the person who brought he and the other entertainers into the conversation.
To address what you say was the overall point of your posts. Some people opinions are a detriment to the community, some aren't just a disagreement but dangerous. To ignore these things to seem inclusive is self defeatist. So they may need to be cast out. So yes some people do disagree because they are coming from different perspectives, culture is apart of that. If one has a sense of culture his/her opinion will be different than ones who isn't(again not speaking of you personally).

No need for the sarcasm. I'm not old nor very wise. I'll acknowledge I'm a student have not reached the level of teacher. What would better our communities? That easy; education, a sense of history of accomplishment, self reliance and ownership all from an Afrocentric perspective. Now implementation is the problem. Whining, following the latest celebrity whims and the other various trends does little or nothing for us.

[Sumyr]

I am new here and on one occasion I have been called a
"roach",
someone who is
"duped by Hollywood movies",
" pay him no mind"
etc.
Now is that humble advice?

Let us all be real clear about this , go to any Black newspaper, progressive radio, or televison program, read or listen to Francis Cress Welsing the late Amos Wilson, the recent speeches of Molefi Asante, Haki Matibuti, Marimba Ani, Chancellor Williams, Queen Afua, Ra Un Nefer Amen and other Afrocentric scholars and they will tell you that the Black community is in a decline,
I simply found it hard that anyone could state otherwise, and when I mentioned that,
I was accused of flaming,
I placed a chain of information and like a man apologized to the moderator and all concerned.

Now many folks on this board are members of one religion or another, some are atheist,
so to my understaning it is a cruel attack on someones belief system to talk about"
"rolling on the ground and foaming at the mouth"
, when I tried to use a comic jesture to flip the script on that remark I get ganged up on by 2 members.
So were is it that I am the initiator of flames when I try to defend myself from a beat down.
As I stated before when you look at the majority of my comments and the reason for my posts it is with a lot of thought and research and concen for all Black people that I make these statements, if some are not famiiliar with what i say or mention I will leave a link or a book, but in some instances folks shoud do thier homework and not take one or 2 words out of my comments out of context.
I am on several boards other then this one and relate views that I have discussed with folks from many political and activist organizations.

Now I wil wait and see!
will we as African folks continue to bicker amongst each other, or are we ready to create a better future for all Black folks across the globe and here!

Natirnr, Thanks for your comments and insight as to what happened in some past threads you were engaged in. But I was a witness for several threads that you did come at some members with the same rhetoric you accuse them of. That was the whole point of my initial thread. (A) we don't listen to each other and (B) we are quick to say that "so-n-so" isn't black, or down for our people, or doesn't know history, blah, blah, blah - just because we don't agree. You have never seen one post from me saying someone isn't black enough, or are "guided by other races" simply because we don't agree. You did come off as attacking one of our long time members and another member called you on it. Now, I will be the first to admit that this member and I don't see eye to eye on much - basically we are down for the same cause but just have differing views of how we should obtain the "same" end results. At the same time I in no shape, form, or fashion would ever degrade myself, by degrading them or their beliefs about our culture. We don't agree, most times, but they are still a part of our African family and culture.

Long story short: We "HAVE" already discussed the issues you pose in some form or another. Sometimes, I laugh at you newbies as you "ALL" run in here and think we don't give a damn about our own simply because we don't jump on your crusade bandwagon. Truth be told, we have been riding this wagon for so long, we now have whiplash from riding so long. But rest assured - we are still here. It's not we don't care, but have grown tired of discussing the same things over and over when all threads have ended the same way - everyone has an "opinion" (myself included) - BUT NO ONE HAS THE ANSWER AND NO ONE IS WILLING TO CONCEDE THEIR OPINIONS FOR THE BETTER OF ALL TO COME TO A MUTUAL ANSWER. Just my observation.

[natirnr]

God bless you Sumyr and everone on the board, and especially those on this thread let us pray for those who want to continue negativity, we must be patient with them so that soon they too will be able to see the light of a beautiful future for our people, and work progressively to that goal.

[Sumyr]

I do not need to link to anything. You proved by you bringing Imus up. You are the person who brought he and the other entertainers into the conversation.
To address what you say was the overall point of your posts. Some people opinions are a detriment to the community, some aren't just a disagreement but dangerous. To ignore these things to seem inclusive is self defeatist. So they may need to be cast out. So yes some people do disagree because they are coming from different perspectives, culture is apart of that. If one has a sense of culture his/her opinion will be different than ones who isn't(again not speaking of you personally).

No need for the sarcasm. I'm not old nor very wise. I'll acknowledge I'm a student have not reached the level of teacher. What would better our communities? That easy; education, a sense of history of accomplishment, self reliance and ownership all from an Afrocentric perspective. Now implementation is the problem. Whining, following the latest celebrity whims and the other various trends does little or nothing for us.

Afrosaxon, Sorry for the sarcasm. But now we are getting somewhere, finally (sorry - last bit of sarcasm). That's easy you say that all we need to do is educate, get a sense of history, self reliance/ownership, etc. and that implementation is the problem. How do you propose we go about implementing these facets into our communities so that we can flourish as a culture?

[natirnr]

Originally Posted by Sumyr

Afrosaxon, Sorry for the sarcasm. But now we are getting somewhere, finally (sorry - last bit of sarcasm). That's easy you say that all we need to do is educate, get a sense of history, self reliance/ownership, etc. and that implementation is the problem. How do you propose we go about implementing these facets into our communities so that we can flourish as a culture?

Like I say we must start from this here internet before those folks shut it down,
I will apologize for calling the brother Saxon centric,
You mention fatigue from being on a wagon too long well, the wagon should have taken us from point ato whatever alphabet down the line, my urgency is that the attacks on our community are happening faster then we have time to chat about them.
These and other networks and discussions are all we have,
and the grassroots have no choice but to use this here device and be the new leaders since many of the so called leaders have not made a collective platform or agenda for the survival of our people.
God bless

Originally Posted by Sumyr

Afrosaxon, Sorry for the sarcasm. But now we are getting somewhere, finally (sorry - last bit of sarcasm). That's easy you say that all we need to do is educate, get a sense of history, self reliance/ownership, etc. and that implementation is the problem. How do you propose we go about implementing these facets into our communities so that we can flourish as a culture?

Thanks for the apology. I did try to get across in the earlier posts that every point was not necessarily about you just what you were saying. If I was effective then I'll say so here, just discussion for me, I was not attacking.
Complete separation because long as our schools are controlled by the state we can only teach a certain way. That is the key because if we properly educate our children everything else will fall into place, eventually.
One thing I do is make free books available whenever possible. I have posted a link here(I think), no one took my up on it, I'll re-post it. Certainly not really all that helpful but if we can make one more person aware we've done something.

[Sumyr]

Complete separation because long as our schools are controlled by the state we can only teach a certain way. That is the key because if we properly educate our children everything else will fall into place, eventually.
One thing I do is make free books available whenever possible. I have posted a link here(I think), no one took my up on it, I'll re-post it. Certainly not really all that helpful but if we can make one more person aware we've done something.

Afrosaxon, I agree with this - that we should educate our children. But I believe private schooling is the key. In my community, there is one private school were 90% blacks attend and there are a slew of public schools where 90% blacks attend. The academic grade point averages, student conduct, attendance rate is all higher at the private school. Then there is the one public school that boasts the same excellence as the private schools, and I believe it is due to the student to teacher ratio as well as the teachers that are employed there. Do you think we should start thinking "smaller" in terms of private schools in order to obtain the "bigger" goal of educating our children.

Hubby and I talk about this frequently and although we are champions of public education and we both benefited from it, we will be sending our kids to the private black school (once we have them that is). What saddens me is that I picked up the paper yesterday and on the front page it read that one of the public schools which houses our black children from our communities will be employing 3 new security guards on campus. 3?????? I can remember back when I was younger all we needed was a principal. The school has a principal and 2 assistant principals - why isn't this enough? I ask this but I already know the answer as they have had a lot of fights there and the last involved 10-15 students and one of the assistants needed medical attention trying to break up the fight. I ask where have we gone wrong and failed our kids (I say "our" even though hubby and I don't have any kids but it is still our collective responsibility as members of the community.)

And if you get a chance, do post the link or direct me to which forum you previously posted about the free books. Are the books for the community (self help books) or are they books children can use in school for course studies or both?

[MadameX]

Originally Posted by Afro Saxon

I do not need to link to anything. You proved by you bringing Imus up. You are the person who brought he and the other entertainers into the conversation.
To address what you say was the overall point of your posts. Some people opinions are a detriment to the community, some aren't just a disagreement but dangerous. To ignore these things to seem inclusive is self defeatist. So they may need to be cast out. So yes some people do disagree because they are coming from different perspectives, culture is apart of that. If one has a sense of culture his/her opinion will be different than ones who isn't(again not speaking of you personally).

No need for the sarcasm. I'm not old nor very wise. I'll acknowledge I'm a student have not reached the level of teacher. What would better our communities? That easy; education, a sense of history of accomplishment, self reliance and ownership all from an Afrocentric perspective. Now implementation is the problem. Whining, following the latest celebrity whims and the other various trends does little or nothing for us.

Valid points indeed.

[robbboy2003]

Originally Posted by natirnr

I am new here and on one occasion I have been called a
"roach",
someone who is
"duped by Hollywood movies",
" pay him no mind"
etc.
Now is that humble advice?

Let us all be real clear about this , go to any Black newspaper, progressive radio, or televison program, read or listen to Francis Cress Welsing the late Amos Wilson, the recent speeches of Molefi Asante, Haki Matibuti, Marimba Ani, Chancellor Williams, Queen Afua, Ra Un Nefer Amen and other Afrocentric scholars and they will tell you that the Black community is in a decline,
I simply found it hard that anyone could state otherwise, and when I mentioned that,
I was accused of flaming,
I placed a chain of information and like a man apologized to the moderator and all concerned.

Now many folks on this board are members of one religion or another, some are atheist,
so to my understaning it is a cruel attack on someones belief system to talk about"
"rolling on the ground and foaming at the mouth"
, when I tried to use a comic jesture to flip the script on that remark I get ganged up on by 2 members.
So were is it that I am the initiator of flames when I try to defend myself from a beat down.
As I stated before when you look at the majority of my comments and the reason for my posts it is with a lot of thought and research and concen for all Black people that I make these statements, if some are not famiiliar with what i say or mention I will leave a link or a book, but in some instances folks shoud do thier homework and not take one or 2 words out of my comments out of context.
I am on several boards other then this one and relate views that I have discussed with folks from many political and activist organizations.

Now I wil wait and see!
will we as African folks continue to bicker amongst each other, or are we ready to create a better future for all Black folks across the globe and here!

Good day natirnr, I have but one question with all your links,and books and all these intelligent type Black Folk telling me how bad things are ie,,(the sky is falling.) With all their books, education world travel and blah,blah, blah. Does any body have a or an s-o-l-u-t-i-o-n !!! peace!

[JABOOM]

Originally Posted by robbboy2003

Good day natirnr, I have but one question with all your links,and books and all these intelligent type Black Folk telling me how bad things are ie,,(the sky is falling.) With all their books, education world travel and blah,blah, blah. Does any body have a or an s-o-l-u-t-i-o-n !!! peace!

I have a very simple solution to all of our problems.......

SCREW THESE DEVILS HERE AND LETS DO EVERYTHING WE NEED FOR OURSELVES!!!!

Like courts...Native Americans have their own court system and trail their own cases involving crime.

Like money...We can come up with a type of money that can only be spent in the black community.

Like education...We should get our own teachers to teach our children what it is they must learn about themselves to gain pride in who they are.

Like crime...We should just come together and talk....

We just saw a back and forth thing that was just unneeded. We as a people want the same things.........so why not just work together instead of against each other to get what it is that we need to survive. Because the more split we are the easier it is for us to keep being beaten down by the rest of the world.