Responsible sexual behavior. . .

[Jackson]

With a plethora of unwanted children in black communities, I want to know what your thoughts are on responsible sexual behavior. There are many children being born to men who don’t want them everyday. 70% of black children are brought up in fatherless homes. I would like to find out just how strict the ladies are concerning condom use. Do you strictly believe that your partner should always use a condom or do you just let him have you without protection in the name of “greater intimacy” and forging a bond based on “trust?” How many of you give in if your man insists that you have unprotected sex with him? Why would any unmarried woman want to have unprotected sex with a man given all the risks that are involved? What inspires that please enlighten me. Furthermore, I want to know whether you ladies are strict where using the pill is concerned. I have read articles in which black women have stated that they became mothers despite not being married because they felt that they were in a stable relationship. I’d think that such a stable relationship would result in wedding bells and rings being exchanged before people have children. A lot of those women end up raising those children alone. This is a pity especially where the male children are concerned because psychology studies show that the parent who is most influential to the upbringing of the child is the one who is of the same sex. That is why most single women more often than not fail to raise productive men. Furthermore do these women who decide to have children out of wedlock because they are in a “stable relationship” first inform their significant other of their decision. Or do they just get off the pill if they were ever on one?

Men, what I want to know is why you would accept to have unprotected sex with a woman you aren’t married to. Many men deny their responsibilities as a father and their excuse is that they had not anticipated that the woman would get pregnant. They then cite that they thought the woman was on the pill. Men should also play their role in being responsible for their sexual behavior. If you aren’t married, strap one on. Granted they have a 90-95% just like birth control pills have a 95% efficiency rate but at least you would be doing your part by being as responsible as possible. Obviously the best way to avoid the pregnancy issue is to simply abstain but that is not always possible, lol. Do men also discuss with their women whether or not the latter is on birth control or is it just assumed and therefore the unprotected sex? If you want to have unprotected sex with your significant other, and you don’t want to have any children, do you at least accompany your woman so that she can go and have a Deprovera shot or get some other form of birth control? Please lets be responsible, let’s think about whether or not our sexual behavior can be classified as responsible. Afrochat, what is your opinion on advocating for responsible sexual behavior as a means to diminish unwanted pregnancies(and obviously HIV and other related diseases). We are all adults here so lets try to keep the responses polite.

Merci beaucoup.

_________________________
As an aside
Ladies, did you know that as women you have a greater surface area than men where your sexual organ viz. the vagina is concerned? This is why women are more vulnerable to HIV than men are (biological synopsis). Research has proven that male to female transmission is 8 times more efficient than female to male transmission. Please either use the femidom or make him use a condom. Your children deserve to come into this world whilst wanted by both parents. Minimize the “accident pregnancies”. Please give this thought. As if the fatherless homes are not enough of an issue, the statistics indicate that half of the people in this country with HIV are African American. This is disturbing especially since we constitute 12% of the population. Ladies and gentlemen, do what is responsible. Know your status and protect yourself. There's been a thread on HIV before. That is why that issue is not at the core of the topic at hand.

Originally Posted by Jackson

I have read articles in which black women have stated that they became mothers despite not being married because they felt that they were in a stable relationship. I’d think that such a stable relationship would result in wedding bells and rings being exchanged before people have children. A lot of those women end up raising those children alone.

It's mental. And Black women don't own the patent on it either. But I'll let them address that.

Originally Posted by Jackson

Men, what I want to know is why you would accept to have unprotected sex with a woman you aren’t married to.

I've heard a variety of reasons but the only one that has ever been an issue for myself is not using one while getting carried away. I don't know about anyone else but there are times when sex is had totally spontaneous and the parties involved are not thinking about children or diseases. That's not the real world. Sure we'd love for everyone to be prepared and always thinking with their brain and not their genitalia, but it don't always work that way. To me the more important issue is taking responsibility for whatever consequences result from the situation.

Originally Posted by Jackson

Obviously the best way to avoid the pregnancy issue is to simply abstain but that is not always possible, lol.

Exactly. When emotions run high and the body starts to respond, the brain doesn't always think about what's right, be it using protection or abstaining all together.

[Proudbrothaman]

You may not have intended to but you sound very judgemental. If you never laced up my Timbo's and walked in them don't judge me.

[Jackson]

If i were judgemental, i wouldn't bother to ask questions on this topic. I would have reached a conclusion on it a long time ago. People who have reached a conclusion they deem satisfactory on a subject matter do not seek any dialogue on it. I seek dialogue on this topic because i want to know what is going on in our communities. I want to know what people believe to be the solution to the numerous unwanted pregnancies. I thought the Think Tank existed for the very fact of finding solutions. How are there going to be any solutions if one cannot even initiate a discussion on the matter?

Originally Posted by RanRan

It's mental. And Black women don't own the patent on it either. But I'll let them address that.

Obviously they don't own that patent. . . none exist for a social crisis. Black women are the ones who lead the pack where unwanted pregnancies and children are concerned. I want to know what they think about this.

Originally Posted by RanRan

I've heard a variety of reasons but the only one that has ever been an issue for myself is not using one while getting carried away. I don't know about anyone else but there are times when sex is had totally spontaneous and the parties involved are not thinking about children or diseases.

I agree with what you are saying. Surely it is for this very reason, that people should make sure that the necessary safeguards are in place from the get go. For example, getting tested together... and retested after six months(sometimes when one is initially tested for HIV, the disease may not yet be detectable despite being in the blood stream. That is why the six months spacing is encouraged). The second thing, and the issue which is at the core of this topic is that surely the lady will be on birth control or have had some other shot, to minimize the chances of an unexpected and unwanted pregnancy? Surely the couple would have discussed the issue of birth control beforehand or do most people not find that necessary.....?

[Eric]

Jackson, you have balls for raising this topic, seriously :) The issue of responsible sexual behavior amongst our people is something i have often wondered about. There are so many fatherless homes and the shame that such a social crisis generates has usually been placed at the feet of the black man. I've always wondered about why we don't explore the core of the issue, which is that a lot of these children are born to men who don't want them to begin with (sad but true) and about the role of both men and women in minimizing the risk of these unwanted pregnancies. I surely hope that the ladies of Afrochat add to this discussion.

I have been dating the same lady for the last 8 years. We are now engaged to be married. For the first few months we used protection. There were times things would take off and then, we'd have to stop when we least wanted to because i did not have any condoms on me. I'd then have to dash off to the pharmacy. . . I'd be driving like a moron, that's for sure However my fiance and i share the same values. Neither of us wanted to have a child out of wedlock. We spoke about birth control and she said she was on the pill. So at that point 9 months into our relationship, i stopped using protection. I was cool with that because i was already smitten by her and i knew that if i had impregnated her at that point, i would have married her anyway. However, i would use the condom as from 5 days before her menstrual cycle kicked in and two to three days after. This is because women are most fertile five days before they experience menstruation and 1 to 3 days after. As time wore on she told me she wanted to get a Depo shot and i accompanied her on that day because hey, i'm just a loving, supportive brother like that :) . I then stopped using protection because we were in a monogamous relationship and Depo shots are very effective. Eight years later, we have no children. We look foward to trying for a child sometime next year after our wedding.

It is the responsibility of both parties, to ensure that they avoid unwanted pregnancies. If everyone did what they are meant to, there would be much less unwanted children in our communities. The issue of unwanted, fatherless children in our community is a saddening one. Every child deserves to enter into this world whilst wanted by both parents. Ladies, please give us your opinion on this, i am keen to find out what you think.

To the moderators, please give young Mr Jackson more rep points/power for always raising thought provoking topics which are of pertinence to our people and for daring to proffer solutions where many men and women opt to resign themselves to dumbfounded silence. Thank you.

Originally Posted by Jackson

A lot of those women end up raising those children alone. This is a pity especially where the male children are concerned because psychology studies show that the parent who is most influential to the upbringing of the child is the one who is of the same sex. That is why most single women more often than not fail to raise productive men. .

That is true. I did my undergrad in psychology and this ^ is the truth that most people in our communities don't seem to be aware of. Honestly ladies, please be careful with yourselves. Most women fail to raise male children properly on their own. It is because of the above. Please don't be with a man who will insist that you have to have unprotected sex with him. Don't acquiesce when you know you aren't on the pill and when you don't feel comfortable with such an arrangement. Both parties should reach such a conclusion without any pressure and other safeguards such as birth control must in place when your other half stops using a condom. Remember, any man who pressures you doesn't really care about you. He is selfish and self serving and you don't need to indulge him. A man who cares about a woman wants her to be comfortable and at peace with such a decision. If he sees that you aren't ready, he should back down. That is how a real man treats a lady.

[Sumyr]

Both parties should reach such a conclusion without any pressure and other safeguards such as birth control must in place when your other half stops using a condom. Remember, any man who pressures you doesn't really care about you. He is selfish and self serving and you don't need to indulge him. A man who cares about a woman wants her to be comfortable and at peace with such a decision. If he sees that you aren't ready, he should back down. That is how a real man treats a lady.

Eric, I didn't quote your entire post, but very well said. :) Chiming in on this discussion from a female view point - although I don't represent nor speak for all females - I have always believed in using protection/birth control. I'm not ashamed to admit that I lost my virginity early (age 16), but I have always been conscious about what I wanted and did not want even at a young age. We're all adults here, so here goes. I knew I wanted to express myself to my significant other through pleasure, but on the same note I knew I (A) did not want any diseases and (B) did not want a baby.

I always insisted that the guy wear a condom. Some were as resolute as I was about using protection/birth control. But of course there was one that absolutely didn't want to, but his wants weren't an option. I was more adamant about it though in my younger days. But even now I still do not want children and take all necessary precautions for prevention.

I think most women get caught up in the emotional aspect of the relationship and equate "I love you baby" with "I'll always be there for you", "If you happen to get pregnant, I will be there for you and the baby," etc. I had this very discussion with the last guy I was just broke up with 2 weeks ago. He did not want to use a condom, no matter how much I insisted. He gave me all kinds of excuses, "baby, you gone let all this loving go to waste," "I love you and we are always going to be together", "I'll pull out when it's time," :yr: "I love you and want you to have my baby," "It doesn't feel the same," etc.

I told him like this: If you really loved me, you would respect my wishes. If you really loved me and wanted me to have your baby, you would want our child to be raised by a mother and a father in marriage 1st, not a baby momma and a baby daddy. We went back and forth for a while about this and what I thought would be a 5-10 minute conversation turned into 2 hours.

Then I put it to him like this. You have two options: (A) You can wear a condom or (B) We can "NOT" have sex at all. He chose option (B) and that was the end of the discussion. Enough said!

Also, Jackson, very good topic for discussion. :terrific:

[Jackson]

Originally Posted by Eric

It is the responsibility of both parties, to ensure that they avoid unwanted pregnancies. If everyone did what they are meant to, there would be much less unwanted children in our communities. The issue of unwanted, fatherless children in our community is a saddening one. [u]Every child deserves to enter into this world whilst wanted by both parents

Exactly......

Originally Posted by Eric

Please don't be with a man who will insist that you have to have unprotected sex with him. Don't acquiesce when you know you aren't on the pill and when you don't feel comfortable with such an arrangement. Both parties should reach such a conclusion without any pressure and other safeguards such as birth control must in place when your other half stops using a condom. Remember, any man who pressures you doesn't really care about you. He is selfish and self serving and you don't need to indulge him. A man who cares about a woman wants her to be comfortable and at peace with such a decision. If he sees that you aren't ready, he should back down. That is how a real man treats a lady.

As usual Counsellor, you've made it a point to step up on the scene correct . Your entire post is a classic. I agree with everything that you said. The ladies should understand that any man who makes her do something she is unhappy/uncomfortable with, is not thinking about her. He is only thinking of himself. If a lady sets aside her standards for such a man, she will be likely to regret it. After all, he has shown her from the inception of intimacy that he is only out to get his own needs met. Such self serving people make good candidates for the MIA syndrome, IMHO. A man who respects and loves a lady, will put her first and will listen to his woman. He is not forceful, he discusses, listens and negotiates (where appropriate).

Originally Posted by Sumyr

I think most women get caught up in the emotional aspect of the relationship and equate "I love you baby" with "I'll always be there for you", "If you happen to get pregnant, I will be there for you and the baby," etc. I had this very discussion with the last guy I was just broke up with 2 weeks ago. He did not want to use a condom, no matter how much I insisted. He gave me all kinds of excuses, "baby, you gone let all this loving go to waste," "I love you and we are always going to be together", "I'll pull out when it's time," :yr: "I love you and want you to have my baby," "It doesn't feel the same," etc.

I told him like this: If you really loved me, you would respect my wishes. If you really loved me and wanted me to have your baby, you would want our child to be raised by a mother and a father in marriage 1st, not a baby momma and a baby daddy. We went back and forth for a while about this and what I thought would be a 5-10 minute conversation turned into 2 hours.

Then I put it to him like this. You have two options: (A) You can wear a condom or (B) We can "NOT" have sex at all. He chose option (B) and that was the end of the discussion. Enough said!

Sumyr, thank you for this wonderful contribution :D . I especially like what you said when you stated that if a man loves a woman and wants a woman to be the mother of his child, naturally he should also want to be married to the mother of that child. This is because having a child together should be the ultimate seal in a loving relationship, why would any man who loves a woman want to impregnate her before he weds her? Sumyr, you are smart for seeing through the . You are a sensible woman and this is evinced by the fact that you don't acquisce on points which you know can only be to your detriment. I wish more women would just put their foot down and not place themselves at the risk of a) getting infected with a nasty virus b) being a single mom. Ladies should always know that a man who really cares will not want to place a lady in a situation whereby she will have to face harsh consequences where a simple thing such as a condom can avoid a lot of drama. Ladies should also do their bit by using birth control. Thanks for that Sumyr and Eric, your posts demonstrate that we all have the power to choose.

[LadyNoir]

Hear! Hear! Very good subject! Very good responses! STD prevention should be a mutual decision and a priority. Even it it takes the two hours Sumry and her sweetie used to discuss and come to the right understanding, it's worth it. Understanding is the best thing in the world!

[Samoon]

Jackson, I am LOVING your comments, Eric's and Sumyr's!!" For yes, we all have the power to choose. It really comes to, "do you value YOU?"

All opinions presented well with thoughtful expression, demonstrating concise, clear thinking and best of all? In my opinion, you all appear to show levels of maturity in that you are no one's fool: you KNOW that if one states that they "value" another individual? Their "actions" will accompany it.

We DO all have choices--and unfortunately "oops babies" are [more often] the result of poor planning. If we are going to seek intimacy with others, then we owe it to ourselves to BE sexually responisible beings. I agree with what Eric stated in this regard, "I've always wondered about why we don't explore the core of the issue, which is that a lot of these children are born to men who don't want them to begin with (sad but true)." THERE ARE A HELL OF A LOT OF VARIABLES THAT COME INTO FOCUS HERE in WHY scores of children are being born out of wedlock. (And on another note, Eric, the black birth-rate in recent years HAS declined whereas the Latin population birth rates, for example, are sky-rocketing). What remains alarming and dismal are the morbidity stats in the black community for communicable diseases...but I digress...another topic.

It is the responsibility of both parties, to ensure that they avoid unwanted pregnancies. If everyone did what they are meant to, there would be much less unwanted children in our communities. The issue of unwanted, fatherless children in our community is a saddening one. Every child deserves to enter into this world whilst wanted by both parents. Ladies, please give us your opinion on this, i am keen to find out what you think.

Well stated, Eric. In my opinion, there is nothing "old school" about two individuals, that, with conscious thought and planning, desire to rear their off-spring together. Unfortunately, the sexual revolution brought more than sexual freedom--it also brought irresponsible behavior, cavalier attitudes and worse, unwanted children. And this is entirely unfair to our children. Sumyr is correct, the female is more apt to be more "emotional" than the male. Many, not all, females have mistakenly viewed their sexual encounters (even if they have one consistent partner) as a form of "emotional committment." And then we see sistas that walk around with "head trips" and you wonder why? Word to the wise? If a male wants you to "have my baby," then he should be evolved and mature enough to PLAN long-term AND committ to the relationship. Otherwise, he is "talking loud and saying NADA." On another note, personally, I do not condone aborting children--nope, abortion is the easy way out for laziness. I call it for what this is in too many cases: too easy because some females are too lazy to practice some form of birth control as there are several available (and this includes discussion, planning and support of a partner). Abortion then becomes a simple case of being trivialized--"important enough" for BOTH individuals to discuss and plan or worse, abortion becomes THE form of birth control "every time" there is an accident.

The height of selfishness is producing children without conscious thought about being responsible to them. Individuals such as this are only self-serving.

Originally Posted by Jackson

surely the lady will be on birth control or have had some other shot, to minimize the chances of an unexpected and unwanted pregnancy? Surely the couple would have discussed the issue of birth control beforehand or do most people not find that necessary.....?

Personally I think condoms are the best form of birth control. I don't like the idea of the pill or shots. I have a problem with anything that some how messes with the reproductive system. I haven't heard much about the shot's side effects but have heard horror stories about the pill.

As for discussions, I've never had a discussion with a young lady concerning birth control. Never really thought to on account I am a believer in condom usage and most times that I am sexually active I use them and there never seems like a need for discussing it. Never had a female tell me that she doesn't like condoms so I never had to demand we use them. And the times where it wasn't a planned encounter and birth control was absent I never had anyone demand we use it either. (I've had some female friends and relatives tell me that they don't like them though.)

Originally Posted by Eric

It is the responsibility of both parties, to ensure that they avoid unwanted pregnancies. If everyone did what they are meant to, there would be much less unwanted children in our communities. The issue of unwanted, fatherless children in our community is a saddening one. Every child deserves to enter into this world whilst wanted by both parents. Ladies, please give us your opinion on this, i am keen to find out what you think.

Agreed. So true. But to me the bigger problem is parents bringing kids in the world and not dealing with it responsibly. A lot of pregnancies are unplanned and inconvenient, but that's no excuse for not giving your child all the love, care, affection, time, money, and knowledge that every child needs and deserves. Children were meant to be the result of a loving relationship between 2 people married under God. But when the opposite happens men and women should be responsible enough to deal with it like an adult and not an idiot.