Who would you Vote for in '08 Election?

[DBlack]

Man, learn to format in basic english; paragraphs. That's nearly impossible to read.

Once again, high minded rhetoric, you never answered the questions:

• What makes the Obama/Edwards ticket the right choice?
• Has ever managed a business or large group of people?
• Has he kicked his drug addiction permanently?
• What has Obama accomplished other than minute local city programs?
• What's Obama's Foreign Policy Experience?
• What's Obama's specific plans for Urban empowerment?

No one knows.....if they do, it's never been posted on this board. Everyone, like you is talking about how much appeal he has. Since when is white approval a prerequisite for black support? That should mean absolutely nothing to us. If you can answer those questions with substance and fact, you'll have me convinced to support him lockstep.

[ezekielscall_2]

Number one...I don't know that Edwards is the right choice to be paired with Obama, but right now, he's the only obvious best choice.

Number Two...I can't say that he has ever managed big business, but when I look at those that have held that office that have operated big business, and look at how they've run this nation...Bush and Cheney in particular, I can't feel bad about Obama's inexperience...maybe this time it's time to look away from the things that we have held as job requirements in the past and look to this one person that has made the right choices even if they were on a smaller level of government to make a difference and to bring about change. Also you just said that you didn't ask me about Viet Nam, so you've shown me there that experience holds for nothing or at least not very much...so Barrack doesn't have the experience of Clinton or Edwards, but what he does have is great vision and a will to get things done the right way, so that we all will benefit...and oh yes, what I did 40 years ago does mean something, and the experiences I've gained from that time should never be overlooked or downplayed...you see, what I do know is that when you can surround yourself with the right mix of people you can accomplish anything you set out to do, my experince with my brothers then is what has me here talking with you today.

Number Three...What do you think?

Number Four...What has Bush's been...What was his father's...Clinton's or Reagan's, and as I remember, Ford was just a snap short of being a buffoon. We have been given a lot of mess...wars and rumors of wars...not to mention a valley full of lies...I believe that change is in order...one thing that I've learned about change, and I've learned it thru my study of the work and ministry of Jesus, is that change is radical...change is never agreeable with everyone...change is always desired but never accepted...and we have this tendency to want change, but don't want the change that change brings. I remember going to hear **** Gregory speak once. After he was done, he did a Q&A session. One of the questions asked of him was why he wouldn't run for president. His response was: Black folk don't want me to be president...they don't want me because, they won't be able to smoke or get high...they won't be able to drink, or remain unemployed...Black folk are going to have to stand and be recognized...and there are a lot of black folk that like things just like they are...and don't truly want change.

Number Four...Again...look at Bush...and all of the others

Number Six...Refer to number to your third question, and then add to that if we, as voters, vote the right people in place to support whatever he sets ou to do.

[ezekielscall_2]

Number one...I don't know that Edwards is the right choice to be paired with Obama, but right now, he's the only obvious best choice.

Number Two...I can't say that he has ever managed big business, but when I look at those that have held that office that have operated big business, and look at how they've run this nation...Bush and Cheney in particular, I can't feel bad about Obama's inexperience...maybe this time it's time to look away from the things that we have held as job requirements in the past and look to this one person that has made the right choices even if they were on a smaller level of government to make a difference and to bring about change. Also you just said that you didn't ask me about Viet Nam, so you've shown me there that experience holds for nothing or at least not very much...so Barrack doesn't have the experience of Clinton or Edwards, but what he does have is great vision and a will to get things done the right way, so that we all will benefit...and oh yes, what I did 40 years ago does mean something, and the experiences I've gained from that time should never be overlooked or downplayed...you see, what I do know is that when you can surround yourself with the right mix of people you can accomplish anything you set out to do, my experince with my brothers then is what has me here talking with you today.

Number Three...What do you think?

Number Four...What has Bush's been...What was his father's...Clinton's or Reagan's, and as I remember, Ford was just a snap short of being a buffoon. We have been given a lot of mess...wars and rumors of wars...not to mention a valley full of lies...I believe that change is in order...one thing that I've learned about change, and I've learned it thru my study of the work and ministry of Jesus, is that change is radical...change is never agreeable with everyone...change is always desired but never accepted...and we have this tendency to want change, but don't want the change that change brings. I remember going to hear **** Gregory speak once. After he was done, he did a Q&A session. One of the questions asked of him was why he wouldn't run for president. His response was: Black folk don't want me to be president...they don't want me because, they won't be able to smoke or get high...they won't be able to drink, or remain unemployed...Black folk are going to have to stand and be recognized...and there are a lot of black folk that like things just like they are...and don't truly want change.

Number Four...Again...look at Bush...and all of the others

Number Six...Refer to number to your third question, and then add to that if we, as voters, vote the right people in place to support whatever he sets ou to do.

[Sasori]

So to answer the question, you don't know why, only because it is a change of pace and hopefully he as the first Nubian President would do good deeds?

Let's look at the most recent 'change of pace' President, the one who others dubbed the first black president simply because he acknowledged us. He actually came to our neighborhoods, played the sax on Arsenio, said he puffed weed but didn't inhale, promised a new day for the American black, but in acuality, this is his legacy

Fact: Clinton raised taxes on the middle class when he raised taxes on the "most wealthy". Trickle down is what ALWAYS happens when you raise taxes on the most wealthy. It's a stealth ploy to take more money out of the pockets of the middle class.

Fact: It was not Clintons idea to cut capital gains taxes. He signed onto a plan pushed by Newt Gingrich with the contract with America thing, that allowed home owners to keep up to 500 thousand dollars from the sale of a private home for a couple and 250 thousand dollars for single home owners. That tax cut was how all those dollars began to float all over the country.

That was when businesses sold big ticket items like washing machines, refrigerators and building supplies. Most remember how so many homes were going up, the price of lumber was going up like a big dog. People were spending that money and it was the tax cut that was responsible. Why the government damn near had a tax surplus and why so many of us were able to get jobs. Not Clintons idea at all.

Fact: Clinton also signed onto the republican plan to end welfare as we know it. Put the cap on welfare benefits at 5 years. That freed up billions in the government.

Fact: Clinton ushered in a counter-terrorism program called 'Eschelon' which gave the NSA the abillity to read all emails and monitor web sites of the American people.


I say this as a democrat with really, no one esle to vote for in my party. But I rather have Obama then Clinton part two

And Edwards... simply look at North Carolina and the progress it has made with the poor's ailments to know that he failed

[saraphen]

Originally Posted by ezekielscall_2

Here's a problem that Black folk can never seem to shake...there are too many of us that suffer from the "crab in the barrel" syndrome...I just had a reply sent to me that Barrack doesn't care about the black vote, and unless you live under a rock, that responder is probably right...Barrack doesn't care about the black vote, he cares about the American vote. .....

Well said!! Obama has my financial support. And I do also think that John Edwards has something fresh to bring to the table in speaking about the great divide between the rich and poor.

I have to apologize for not being present the way I used to be on this site, but life happens.

Anyway, I think we need to stop using the old criteria to measure the new voices. Washington experience has gotten us into the mess we're in in Iraq; Big business experience has trashed our economy. I'm wearing my Obama button today with a new sunrise on it!!

[Istlota]

It never fails. Come a presidential election year, there is always at least one democratic hopeful whose campaign starts messing with black church folks' heads, trying to convince them that God and their candidate are boyz.

I am more inclined to think that God wants nothing to do with American politics. I think it is the Beast and the Dragon who have more riding on that game.

[Sasori]

God hasn't or has ever taken sides in a government's politics. Involving the religious into it is similar to what Bush has done with his fundamental zealots and you see how well that worked out.

Religion should have no part in the political decisions of a nation

[DBlack]

Originally Posted by ezekielscall_2

Number one...I don't know that Edwards is the right choice to be paired with Obama, but right now, he's the only obvious best choice.

You, and others keep saying that, but you don't back it up with anything factual.

Number Two...I can't say that he has ever managed big business, but when I look at those that have held that office that have operated big business, and look at how they've run this nation...Bush and Cheney in particular, I can't feel bad about Obama's inexperience...maybe this time it's time to look away from the things that we have held as job requirements in the past and look to this one person that has made the right choices even if they were on a smaller level of government to make a difference and to bring about change.

Again, this is about Obama, not about how YT has abused their opportunities. Chosing one candidate based on what another candidate did or did not do, is not an intelligent way to chose a candidate. You have to be objective and smart about what you want or think is important. If you are telling me that we as a nation should be lead by someone with no experience in managing large groups of people even as a business, that is foolhardy. The needs of America, it's economy, it's foreign and domestic policies are very complex. You can't expect someone to play in the NFL, if they've never or or barely football.

Also you just said that you didn't ask me about Viet Nam, so you've shown me there that experience holds for nothing or at least not very much...so Barrack doesn't have the experience of Clinton or Edwards, but what he does have is great vision

Your Vietnam experience, is irrelevant in this discussion. Furthermore, I'm not a Clinton or Edwards supporter, so please, for the sake of the debate, stop brining up other candidates; they are irrelevant here. Because of my huge level of distrust for virtually all of the white white candidates, I can't support them. But I can admit, most of them do have more experience managing government, whether you agree with their policies or not.

WHAT VISION? You mean hope?! Go to his website. He talks great, but that's not evidence of work done. Talking a good game is wonderful, but don't you think you should see if his actions match his words? I challenge you do do that.

and a will to get things done the right way, so that we all will benefit...and oh yes,

Again, you have yet to state any object reason why you can assert what he WILL DO. If he hasn't demonstrated it in the past, what makes you think any candidate will do it in the future. Do you just go around trusting people based on what they tell you? I hope you would not.

what I did 40 years ago does mean something, and the experiences I've gained from that time should never be overlooked or downplayed...you see, what I do know is that when you can surround yourself with the right mix of people you can accomplish anything you set out to do, my experience with my brothers then is what has me here talking with you today.

This ain't about you. Your Vietnam experience don't mean squat to me and it's irrelevant in this discussion. And since you are sabre-rattling, Obama never served, and probably spent that time on drugs, like many other candidates. You seem to avoid commenting on that, hmmm...

Number Three...What do you think?

I believe that, purely based on his RECORD, not promises (which all politicians never keep) he will set back the black political progress that many have made great strives for. What record do I speak of: His lack of serious leadership experience on even a state level; His immoral conduct with drugs/crime. While he has been in the government, Obama hasn't championed a single bill of significance. NOT One. He's no Colin Powell, Martin Luther, Jessee Jackson, Al Sharpton. Show me his RECORD.

Number Four...What has Bush's been...What was his father's...Clinton's or Reagan's, and as I remember, Ford was just a snap short of being a buffoon.

Again, this ain't about OTHER candidates; i didn't vote for none of these morons except Clinton. And Clinton DOES have a record of accomplishment that did in fact help and benefit blacks. But he's not running, so why are we talking about him.

We have been given a lot of mess...wars and rumors of wars...not to mention a valley full of lies...I believe that change is in order...one thing that I've learned about change, and I've learned it thru my study of the work and ministry of Jesus,

I agree, it is a mess, but that doesn't answer the questions about Obama, now does it? Jesus and politics don't mix. Amerikkka is not the middle east and we don't and should not mix Politics with Religion. And just so you know, Obama was not entirely raised on Christian values.

is that change is radical...change is never agreeable with everyone...change is always desired but never accepted...and we have this tendency to want change, but don't want the change that change brings.

You are all over the place on this. YOu want change? What change do you want? Do you even know? If you know what change you want, does your favorite candidate show the ability to invoke such change? You still can't answer the question truthfully, because you, like so many others, are blinded by the 'hope' card.

Number Four...Again...look at Bush...and all of the others

Learn to debate or reason. Bush and 'all the others' have nothing to do with this topic or reason to support another candidate.

The democratic platform, not the party, should be the reasons we support them. Since Borama and the lot of white democrats no longer reflect the platform, they don't deserve my support. But then agian, this is why I am filing independent. I want a black president, but purely so we can have one. Truth of the matter is you are sadly like so many of us, making the same horrible judgments when we pick our leaders; either too incompetent or lazy to objectively evaluate their accomplishments as well as their vision.

A vision means nothing if you've never put it into motion.

Hope is a cognitive ointment and pimpgame, long played on the black vote. I can hope for a million dollars, but I still have to get my ahzz up in the morning and go to work.

[DBlack]

Originally Posted by Sasori

So to answer the question, you don't know why, only because it is a change of pace and hopefully he as the first Nubian President would do good deeds?

Let's look at the most recent 'change of pace' President, the one who others dubbed the first black president simply because he acknowledged us. He actually came to our neighborhoods, played the sax on Arsenio, said he puffed weed but didn't inhale, promised a new day for the American black, but in acuality, this is his legacy

Fact: Clinton raised taxes on the middle class when he raised taxes on the "most wealthy". Trickle down is what ALWAYS happens when you raise taxes on the most wealthy. It's a stealth ploy to take more money out of the pockets of the middle class.

Fact: It was not Clintons idea to cut capital gains taxes. He signed onto a plan pushed by Newt Gingrich with the contract with America thing, that allowed home owners to keep up to 500 thousand dollars from the sale of a private home for a couple and 250 thousand dollars for single home owners. That tax cut was how all those dollars began to float all over the country.

That was when businesses sold big ticket items like washing machines, refrigerators and building supplies. Most remember how so many homes were going up, the price of lumber was going up like a big dog. People were spending that money and it was the tax cut that was responsible. Why the government damn near had a tax surplus and why so many of us were able to get jobs. Not Clintons idea at all.

Fact: Clinton also signed onto the republican plan to end welfare as we know it. Put the cap on welfare benefits at 5 years. That freed up billions in the government.

Fact: Clinton ushered in a counter-terrorism program called 'Eschelon' which gave the NSA the abillity to read all emails and monitor web sites of the American people.


I say this as a democrat with really, no one esle to vote for in my party. But I rather have Obama then Clinton part two

And Edwards... simply look at North Carolina and the progress it has made with the poor's ailments to know that he failed

Put a little intelligence into your desire for change. What change do you want? You don't even know. Picking a candidate purely for the sake of changing is retarded, because you don't even know what you are changing to. Do you?

You know why its so easy for you and others to talk about Clinton, Edwards, Bush, INSTEAD of Obama? It's because OBAMA hasn't done anything significant in his life for which you can render intelligent judgement.

This ain't about Clinton. YOu want to cherry pick Clinton, have at it. How about putting our brother under the same critical microscope and see what you come up with.

[DBlack]

Originally Posted by saraphen

Well said!! Obama has my financial support. And I do also think that John Edwards has something fresh to bring to the table in speaking about the great divide between the rich and poor.

I have to apologize for not being present the way I used to be on this site, but life happens.

Anyway, I think we need to stop using the old criteria to measure the new voices. Washington experience has gotten us into the mess we're in in Iraq; Big business experience has trashed our economy. I'm wearing my Obama button today with a new sunrise on it!!

I agree Saraphen, we need to change the way we measure our candidates. But blanket selection without objective evaluation of leadership only brings more guarantees of the same ole same ole. Only this time the guy will someone that looks like us.